Financial Fitness for Wellness Coaches

Catalyst Coaching Podcast

Financial Fitness for Health & Wellness Coaches: How to Price Wellness Coaching and Other Coaching Business Topics

Welcome to Catalyst Health and Wellness Coaching podcast. My name is Brad Cooper and I’ll your host and today we’re going to talk about financial fitness for coaches. You know, just to let you know a lot of our ideas for topics for the podcasts come from you. So if there’s something you want to hear about, drop us an email and I’ll mention this at the end, but just send it to Again, that’s and we’ll put it in the hopper and we’ll tee it up for a future one if it’s something we’re hearing from a lot of people about. But this is one that we constantly are hearing about. There are really two areas. One is just the overall financial fitness of coaching. You have a lot more opportunities if you have your financial house in order. It’s just as easy as that straightforward.

The question that usually comes first is how do I price my services? And that conversation almost always turns around and coaches realize, well, wait a minute, I don’t need to worry about how to price it. I need to worry about how to handle it first and once I’ve got that figured out, that then will help me drive the pricing piece. So we’re going to focus today on the financial fitness piece, how to handle the money we have, and then we’ll come back with a future, we call them the business of coaching episodes, and we’ll talk about how to price your services and those kinds of things. So there’s an old saying, I heard it years ago when I was in this kind of mentorship group in the concept was it’s not how much you make, it’s how much you keep and if you’ve read the book, “The Millionaire Next Door,” that’s what that book is all about.

The concept of that book is you’ve got a lot of people out there that they look like millionaires, but they’re just getting by on debt. And you’ve got a lot of other people that you’d never suspect are millionaires. Just the way they’re living, driving their cars into the ground, live in the same house for decade or decades, but turns out they’ve learned how to handle their money much better. And so that’ll really be the focus of this as we talk through financial fitness specifically for wellness coaches and how you integrate that in. So keep that in mind, and let’s get started.

Alright, so financial fitness for coaches. Love this quote from Zig Ziglar: “The chief cause of failure and unhappiness is trading what we want most for what we want now”. That just sums up your wellness coaching, doesn’t it? I mean, what you’re talking about with your clients is helping them focus on what they want most instead of simply grabbing at what they want now. Well, the same thing’s true in our financial fitness. It’s so easy to get, not necessarily keep, but to get money. How many credit card offers do you get in the mail everyday? How many loan offers do you get? How many random Robo calls did you get from organizations trying to give you “free money”? What they mean is at 20 percent interest. It’s easy to get short term, but we want to focus on the long term. We want to make sure that what we’re looking at in terms of this is the long term.

And so the very first concept I want to start you off with is what I called the 70/20/10 rule. It basically says you live on 70 percent of your money, you invest 20 percent of your money, and you give 10 percent of your money. It’s not a Brad concept. You’ve heard it before. There are different variations of it. Sometimes it’s an 80/10/10 where you’re living on 80, you’re investing 10, you’re giving 10. Whatever your numbers are, it’s that concept of being consistent. Of saying, regardless of where I am, I’m going to live on less than what I make, and those numbers may vary. The 70/20/10 may vary slightly from month to month or year to year based on the phase of life you’re in and the things you have going on. But the general concept holds. You make a certain amount. You live on less than that amount and the difference between what you live on and what you’re making is your margin. A company would call it a profit margin. No margin, no mission.

It’s usually associated with organizations. You could think of it with your coaching business in this case, but the concept is if you don’t have a margin, it’s not possible to have a mission because you’re just getting by. You’re surviving. Now, this does not just simply apply to finances. It’s time, it’s energy. It’s one of the things that you’re helping as a wellness coach, your clients create greater margin in their lives as you help them build and improve sleep and energy and all these other things, they have greater margin. They’re able to then give more to others, and I don’t just mean financially, but volunteer and spend more time, more energy, more focus, all those other things. But in today’s context, we’re going to focus on that concept in the financial arena. The greater your margin, the greater your potential mission.

Now, some people, their mission is themself and the more they make, the more they can spend on themself. Okay, that’s some people, it’s probably not you or you wouldn’t be doing what you’re doing, but the fact of the matter is we all have a mission and the more we build in that margin, the more opportunity we have to address that mission. Let me just walk you through a few things and and by the way, as far as context here, a lot of this information comes from our coaching CMBA. If you’re interested in that kind of stuff, you can go to It’s our coaching CMBA. It’s just a real simple 11 module system you can work through. It’s business specific to coaching, but I’m going to talk to a lot of the financial aspects of that today and the initial steps are five.

#1: Set and follow a budget

#2: Pursue debt free status.

#3: Establish your emergency account

#4: Capitalize on compounding for retirement

#5: Model for the next generation.

So let’s start by talking about this personal budgeting idea. I know if you’re anything like me, you’re sitting there, you’re squirming a little bit. You’re going, oh no, I don’t like budgets. I get it. I get it, I don’t either and maybe you’ll get to a point where you build in enough margin and that’s one of the fun things about getting this thing in place is once you’ve built in enough margin, then you can start to step away from that and just keep an eye on it from a more global level. But initially, and especially as you’re starting your business or growing your business as a coach, you want to have a handle on what are those key elements? Where’s the money going? Where are you spending it? Where are you making it?

And so look at those things and again, I get it. Some of you are already coaching and you’ve got revenue coming in. Some of you are looking at this and saying, um, Brad I haven’t started yet. Either way is fine. Conceptually either camp that you’re in right now is fine because you can sit down and say, okay, what do I need to be making to create that margin? Go through all your expenses and figure out what’s the minimum you can get by on. If you were to eliminate a lot of the stuff, then what’s leftover and the budgeting process, it’s nothing technical. It’s basically just writing down where am I spending my money? It’s like a runner writes down what their intervals are. It’s like somebody who’s tracking, their eating, writing down where they’re putting their calories in, what format? Same thing. You’re just tracking this for your finances and figuring out where’s my money going because you can’t fix something until you know where it’s going.

Most folks, you ask how their money expenditures are broken down and they’re like, no idea. So that’s step one. There are a lot of tools out there. is one that has gotten a lot of positive press. It’s We don’t have any affiliation with them, but I’ve heard from many people that’s a very good tool. It’s online. I believe they have a free option. You plug in some of your data so you probably going to receive some ads from that kind of thing or you can pay for a low cost one, but try to avoid paying for anything. That’s the whole concept right now. Try to avoid paying for those things right now until you get it established and then maybe eight months down the road, two years down the road you say, you know what, it’s worth the small investment to avoid the ads and that makes sense. But initially just use that tool.

Or just use a piece of paper. Just go through and write down where is all your money going? Break it into general categories. Look at where are we spending, how much are we spending on food? How much you’re spending on gas. Do we have a car payment? Do we have a mortgage? Do we have school expenses? Do we have debt? Do we have all these areas? Just jot them down and look at them and say, Huh, I had no idea I was spending that much on coffee or whatever the category is. So step one, establish that budget. is a nice tool, but so as a piece of paper. The key is consistency.

Number two, the envelope method. It’s a very simple method that’s been around for decades and it really works. Suzanna and I used this early on in our marriage, our kids use this and basically you just decide how much am I going to spend in these optional areas? So you’re not going to use an envelope for your mortgage. You’re not going to use an envelope for electric bill. The things that you know are coming in, you simply budget for those. But your optional areas, eating out, entertainment, those types of things, the envelope method works great because what you do, and entertainment’s a great example. What you do is you say, okay, we’re going to spend $100 on the entertainment in the beginning of the month. You take $100, you put it in an envelope, and when it’s gone, you’re done spending money on entertainment that month. And there’s nothing magical about a hundred. You decide what that is. Again, it depends on how much you’re making, how much debt you have, those types of things, but you decide what that number is and when the envelopes empty, then you know that it’s TV and book time until the next month.

The nice thing about the envelope method is one, it’s short term. You’re not committing to a year. You’re not saying, oh no, I spent it all. I don’t get to go out to eat for the next 11 months. It’s 30 days, so if you want to go to that concert and you blow it all on the fourth, no big deal. It’s 26 days, you’re fine. By the same token, it’s fun to look at that envelope and say, you know what? I think I could save 20 bucks extra and put that in the next month. So it’s a nice visual, and again, this is utilized for your optional categories, those things that you really choose a little more, a little less each time. So look at your budget, figure out those things that are optional that you have some control over, you’re choosing. You’re deciding. And use the envelope method for that. Super powerful, super simple, costs you nothing.

And then the last concept with this budgeting piece is budget the people you’re spending time with. That’s kind of a funny comment, isn’t it? Well, I’m talking to a wellness coaches here and future wellness coaches, so you get this, you know very clearly the research says that we become the five people we spend the most time with and for your clients, that’s true of exercise patterns. That’s true of eating habits. You know they say you can tell the average calories you’re going to eat by the five people you eat lunch with. Look at that in terms of your money. Who are you spending time with? Because maybe you can’t afford to spend time with the people you’re spending time with. I’m not saying fire your friends. I’m just saying figure out, does your income match the people you’re spending time with because you’re going to want to take the vacations that your friends are taking. You’re going to want to buy the bikes you’re friends are buying. You’re going to want to eat out at the restaurants you’re friends are eating at it, etc., etc, etc.

So take a look at that, and again, I’m not saying fire your friends, I’m just saying think it through. Who we hanging out with and do we need to change that up a little bit because we’re going to mimic their patterns. That’s not debatable. That’s how we’re made. So five people, big thing.

All right. Let’s talk about this debt reduction concept. I’m going to talk about a technique that Dave Ramsey uses. If you haven’t looked into Dave Ramsey, look into Dave Ramsey. Wonderful Strategies, very well stated, and it’s worked for so many people that if you’re not aware of his stuff, it’s definitely something you want to look into. Just Google him if you’re not familiar with him, you’ll see plenty of information on him, but he has this concept called the debt reduction snowball.

When I first read the debt reduction snowball, my initial thought was, wait, what? That doesn’t make any sense, but he makes the point that we don’t get into financial trouble. We don’t get into debt because we’re logical. We get into debt because we’re emotional. When it comes to finances, he’s right. His concept is you can’t use logic to get out of debt when logic didn’t get you into debt. So that’s what the debt snowball comes in. Step one, write down every debt you have. Then list, so this is student loans, this is mortgages, this is card, this is credit card, this is macy’s bill, this is target, whatever, okay, take every single, every single one of them, list them from smallest to largest by the total amount. So if you owe $100,000 in your home and you owe $182 on your JC Penney’s card, then list those out smallest to largest.

Now the typical advice is to pay the one that has the highest interest rate, and logically, yes, that would make sense, but logic is not what got us into debt. So logic not going to get us out of debt, and so he takes a different approach. He says, smallest to largest, and then do every single thing you can, throw everything you’ve got at that smallest one until it’s gone. Pay the minimum on the rest. Don’t worry about the percentages for each one. Pay the minimum on the rest and then move to the second one. Throw everything you’ve got at it, pay the minimum on the rest, etc. etc. etc.

What happens is you create this snowball effect and you get excited and you start seeing your actions have an impact. You start looking at and you say, oh my gosh, I had eight debts now I have six debts. This is exciting. I’m having an impact. I’m making it. I’m reducing this down and you continue to do that until your debt’s gone completely. Now maybe the mortgage, we can have a long conversation about that one. We’re not going to have today because there are a lot of ways to look at that, but at a minimum, getting rid of all other debt, it changes your life and folks for you in the context of starting or building your coaching business, that’s immense. Your choices on how you run your business are dramatically different when you’re debt free then when you have debt. It changes your options. I can’t tell you, just look at us. When we started Us Corporate Wellness, we didn’t really know what we were doing, but we were able to take a few more risks with that and invest a few more dollars trying to get that going because we had avoided debt in the other areas.

We did have a mortgage at the time, by the way, but we didn’t have car payments. We didn’t have school loans. We’d worked to pay all those things off over the first 20 years of our lives and so we were able to put more risk, more investment into this other area that we wouldn’t have had the option to do otherwise. So keep that in mind with what you’re doing with your debt and just know that as you work your debt down, try your darnedest to get rid of all the rest of that debt because that is going to open up so many opportunities for you in growing your business and moving forward.

Next step, I want to talk a little bit about different revenue streams. I think we see this a lot with coaches. They go through the certification or they’re at a conference or whatever it might be, and they get really excited because it’s a great profession. Let’s face it, those of you who do it are doing it, you get that. If you are thinking about it and you haven’t heard the episode with Cindy and Jamie were the ones that came in and talked about what it’s really like to be a coach, pull that one up. It’s a cool thing to get to do. You’re waking up every morning realizing you have a chance to change lives. That’s a great way to spend your life. But go from a full time well paying job to suddenly quitting without a plan on how to pay for your mortgage and your gas and your groceries and everything else. You might be making a mistake.

One of the great things about coaching is the ability to bootstrap. You can start your coaching business while you’re working your other job. If you’re willing to put in the work, it’s one of the great things about it. There’s limited overhead. Just have to get trained and you don’t have to spend 40 hours a week on it. You could, but you can do it while you’re paying your bills through other areas, so keep that in mind.

Next opportunity is getting rid of the “It’s only” categories. It’s only five bucks for a cup of coffee. It’s only $8 for lunch. It’s only x, y, z for a cell phone. As you go through your budget. That’s the cool thing about doing the budget is your eyes just go, oh my word. I had no idea because it does feel like an “It’s only”, it’s only $5 to get that cup of coffee, but if I’m doing it 20 days, that’s $100 a month. That’s $1,200 a year. It adds up. That’s just the coffee piece. Forget the lunch.

That’s the great thing about budgeting, you decide where your money goes. It’s the whole concept of living on purpose. Just like you help your clients do the same thing with their eating and their exercise, their time, their sleep. You’re doing the same thing with your money. So it’s fine to go either route, but do it on purpose, don’t do it accidentally. So you look at those different areas, cable bill, wireless phone, coffee, eating out or groceries, things like cars. Accountants will tell you a car is an asset. The reality is it’s not an asset. It’s an expense because the purpose of a car to get you from point A to point B, anything above the cost of doing that is not an asset, it’s an expense. So if I can get from point A to point B, I think our car has 160,000 miles on it. Now if I can get from point A to point B with 160,000 mile car and I can continue to do that up until 200,000, 210,000 miles with no car payments for an extra whatever years and then pay cash for the next car. How far ahead does that put me?

So it’s those kinds of concepts. Yes, it’d be nice to have a new car. I would love a new car. We’ve got a few issues with this one, but I don’t need a new car. I’d rather be able to put that money towards something else. So track that. Again, the whole concept is being purposeful. I’m preaching to the choir, you’re all about living purposeful. That’s what wellness coaching is. We’re talking about taking that concept and bringing it into our finances. With the revenue side of the finances, so we talked about reducing expenses, but I started that conversation by saying, keep that job for awhile. Eventually you’ll be able to pull away as you grow your business, but that’s one of the really valuable thought process to go through is to look at it and say, okay, my goal is to drive this much income through coaching and then what else?

What else? I was a member of the national speakers association for a number of years when I was traveling around the country doing a lot of talks, really good organization, worth checking into, and one of the things they shared with me is you want to have multiple streams of income. In fact, there’s a book out there called multiple streams of income. It’s probably, boy, I don’t know, 20 years old now, but just think of the concept. Multiple streams of income. You have your coaching. Do you have another stream early on? Well, yeah. Your other job as you’re getting started, maybe you do pick up a couple of speaking opportunities where you’re paid to speak. It’s tough to get, but every once in a while it’ll happen. Your investments, your investments, wait, what? Yeah. Yeah.

If you look at your income in a pie chart and think about what’s driving income when you’re in your twenties, early thirties, you’re just, you’re trying to get rid of school loan debt, if you have any of that, you’re trying to of get out of the gate with your, with your new job, potentially having kids during that time, so you got a lot of extra expenses there. It’s a different world, but if you can gradually put that money aside, then that investment, the average investment called the rule of 72, whatever your your percentage return is, so it’s a return of eight percent a year pretty close to what we’ve seen over the last 25 years. If it’s an eight percent return, that means your money doubles every nine years because nine years times eight percent return is 72. So whatever money you put away at the age of 22, when you’re 31, that money will double without adding anything. If it’s invested in, say, a typical stock ETF. So rule 72 is powerful and you can see what happens with that as you get older.

If you start early, and that’s the goal is to by the time you’re ready to be done working or pull back from work that your investments make up a large or all of your pie chart and your work gradually decreases over time. So that’s longterm perspective, but I just don’t wanna I don’t wanna forget that in this discussion of where we’re going with the finances, keep that in mind. Think about what are these different things we can be doing? How can we drive other investment earnings and reduce those expenses? Now with your business, and we’ll talk about this more in a future business of coaching episode, but just a couple of comments about some of the numbers that you want to keep track of as you’re building your business. There are four basic areas. You have your upfront investment, you have fixed expenses, you have variable expenses and you have marginal income.

Let’s go through each one of those up front investment. That’s what you’ve got to put into your business before you can do anything. Probably the most obvious answer is you need to get certified as a wellness coach, so until you have that, you don’t have a business. For a company, one of their upfront investments might be buying some equipment of some sort. These are things that you have to have before you can do anything. Okay, so they’re upfront there before you start any revenue.

Fixed expenses, those are things that happen while you’re running your business, but they stay static over time. So for a typical organization that would be your lease, so you have a physical therapy clinic and you pay your monthly lease. The landlord does not come to you every month and say, oh, you had 300 clients so you owe me more, or you had 20 clients so you don’t have to pay as much this month. A fixed expense is the same month after month after month.

You won’t have too many of those. Now you will have some. I’m not an accountant, I’m not giving you accounting advice or legal advice here, but some small business owners might find that you can have your cell phone become a business expense. If that’s true, if your accountant tells you that, that would be an example of something that would be fixed, that’s going to be a constant expense. Whether you have two clients, no clients, or 100 clients, that number’s going to stay the same. So that’s one category.

The variable expense, those are the things that change as your clients grow. So this might be like we have a portal that you can rent, you lease it by the number of clients you have, so you would pay slightly more. You pay an extra $5 per month for each of those clients that you’re working with. So something like that would be a variable expense. If you have three clients, you’re paying a very small amount. If you have 100 clients, you’re paying a larger amount, but on a per client basis, your variable expenses remain the same or potentially go down as you grow your business. You have fixed expenses flat, variable expenses go up and down based on your clientele and as a coach, you generally, especially early on, want to lean towards more variable expenses because it reduces your risk.

The last thing I mentioned is marginal income. This is the income you make on your next client to walk in the door and that is a really, really important concept to keep in mind because most people look at average. They’ll look at it and say, oh, I have 10 clients. I charge this much per month, and we’ll get into that in a future episode by the way, I know those questions are coming. I charge this much per month, when I take out my expenses I average this much income per person. Not a bad thing to know, definitely worth looking into, but it’s almost more important to know your marginal income. Marginal income is the amount you make on the next client to walk through the door. So what that does is it builds in your fixed and your up front expenses in your first whatever, 10 clients, and then on your 11th client how much you’re making, because that will help you price things more effectively over time. So consider that marginal income as the income on the next client that you work with. That’s gonna help you a lot in terms of how you price things.

So four questions in terms of bootstrapping, how many clients will this cost me? That is such a great question for you as a wellness coach it’s saying that all that glitters isn’t gold. Oh, so true. When it comes to building a business, it is. I mean you, you walk through the office store and you’re like, oh, I love that desk. That’s such a cool chair. I need a new laptop, I need this, I need that. Do you need it or do you want it? Ask yourself, based on our last comment, that marginal income, how much do you make? What is your profit margin? What is your margin on the next client that you work with? Is it $10 a month? $50 a month, what does that number and then based on that number, how many clients will it cost you to buy that item and instead of thinking of things in dollars, think of it in terms of client months, so if you’re charging your clients by the month and that’s one of the things we’re going to encourage you to do in the pricing discussion, that if you’re charging your clients by the month, how many client months will it costs you to buy that laptop? How many client months will it cost you to buy that desk chair? You get the idea so you’re not thinking in terms of dollars. Yes, still think in terms of dollars people, that’s the best way to go with your budget, but when you process it in your brain, think about it in terms of how many clients will this cost me?

Now the second thing is very closely related to it is the difference between saving money and reflection on your business. Yes, you want to save money, but you’re building a brand. What’s that brand look like to your client? Now, don’t go down the stupid path here. Rationalization is a wonderful tool, I am great at rationalization, but it’s not real effective. And it’s easy for me to say, oh yeah, I totally need that for some of my clients, you know, think I’m more respectable or whatever, dude, seriously, let’s focus on the basics first.

Make sure we’re credible as a coach, let’s run down the path of the CWC certification or the NBHWC national board exam. Those two elements by themselves go so much further than anything else you can do, but don’t ignore the other pieces. When you go out to speak, do you have a professional looking handout that you leave behind? Do you have a good looking business card? Have you looked at your signature line on your email? Does your email match your website so it’s not or, which is fine if I’m working with friends and family doing coaching, but if I’m actually running a business, not real good. So those are the things that you want to keep in perspective of what’s reflecting my own business and what am I harming by trying to “save money.”

Tied into that is keeping the key elements in perspective. One of the big financial discussions we had early on with US Corporate Wellness was the URAC accreditation. It’s a national accreditation. It’s an organization that oversees wellness companies and there were only a handful of organizations that had gone through this and it’s really expensive. It costs tens of thousands. I’m not saying you should do this by the way, not now. Maybe it’s something down the road, but it costs tens of thousands of dollars just to have them come and look at you. And we looked at that and said, we’re really small. We don’t make a lot of money, should we really invest that kind of money? And we decided that our goal, again, our company name was US Corporate Wellness. Our plan was to provide employee wellness programs for organizations nationally. So we decided, yeah, that’s a route we need to go. And we’ve continued doing that now. We’ve been accredited for 10 years.

I’m not saying you should be URAC accredited, but when it comes to pursuing things, it’s worth the extra investment. I guess the best example for most of you would be that national board exam through the NBHWC. It costs you money. Not a lot, but it costs you money. It costs you time more than anything and effort and energy, but it’s going to be worth it to you as a professional. Don’t go so far down the path of I’ve got to save money that you miss building a great business. Last comment on this and then I’ll kind of tie things up is ask yourself if you’ve done your part before you try to buy results for your company. I can promise you, because it happens everyday to us, you’re going to have a lot of people knock on your door telling you how they can bring clients to you.

Advertising, sponsorship features in newspapers and magazines and talk shows and all this stuff for the low price of whatever. Folks, have you done your part first? Once in a while, those things are worth doing. We started investing a lot more in SEO because that’s important. The Catalyst Coaching Institute, the only way people are going to find it, generally, is online. If we don’t have an online presence, you’re not going to find us. So we’ve decided we need to invest there, but the other 17 options that people call me with every week we could spend endless dollars, but until we’re doing our job, until we’re writing the blogs, doing the speaking engagements, etc. Etc. Etc. Don’t even think about spending money on those things. So I just want to encourage you, don’t try to buy the things that you can do first on your own.

So that brings us to the end of this episode of the Catalyst Health and Wellness Coaching podcast. Again, as I mentioned out of the gate, many of the topics we get our requests from you directly, so if you’ve got ideas, send them our way. We’ll keep that list going and we’ll keep rolling these things out based on what we’re hearing from our listeners. There are also a lot of resources around this topic and others under the special reports page on the website, but please, if there’s something that’s missing, let us know. The reason this podcast exists is to help you grow your coaching business to become more effective as a coach and to live the life that you wanted to live. So that gives you some ideas of how you can boot strap out of the gate. Again, the focus of this podcast today is getting our financial house in order. Once we reduce that debt, once we improve those margins, we can live the mission that we want to live. It just simply gives us more options.

So we’ll come back and do additional episodes on the marketing piece and how to price your coaching services and that of thing. But before you worry about those things, put a big emphasis on getting the financial house in order. Getting your arms around, being purposeful in every aspect of how your money is treated. So that brings us to the close of another episode of the Catalyst Health and Wellness Coaching podcast. Thanks for joining us. We really appreciate you sharing the news, this podcast has grown like crazy over the first two months it’s been in existence and that’s because of you. There are so many podcasts out there. It’s hard for people to find what they’re looking for when there’s something new out there and so you’re obviously sharing it. We really appreciate it.

Thank you so much. In terms of future topics, as I mentioned at the beginning, please let us know what you’d like to hear. We’ve got several teed up. I’ve got some interviews with some really great authors and researchers, a number of other coaches sharing what they’re doing with their coaching careers, where they came from, what that looks like, and we’re going to continue to build on those, but we want to continue to add what you’re asking for. This is one of those, financial fitness. How can we help enhance that and we will, as I mentioned before, we will be addressing things like marketing, how to price your coaching services, those kinds of things down the road, but I felt like we needed to start with a baseline and helping all of us, myself included remember that step one is living with purpose, spending with purpose and not just letting life kind of accidentally come at us. So I hope you found this helpful. Thanks again for spreading the word and we’ll see you soon on the next episode of the Catalyst Health and Wellness Coaching podcast.

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